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	<title>Comments on: Watercooled LED backlit LCD</title>
	<atom:link href="http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/</link>
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		<title>By: andre</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-81264</link>
		<dc:creator>andre</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Jul 2009 16:54:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-81264</guid>
		<description>someone should try that with the 100W LED :)

otoh, this isn&#039;t as silly as it sounds, put the LEDs in a plastic tube (or inside some silicone tubing) and run coolant oil through that, then mount the assembly in place of the CCFLs on a conventional surplus LCD panel as edge lighting.

/me scuttles off to try this...
Inspired by this and someone&#039;s PC mod.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>someone should try that with the 100W LED :)</p>
<p>otoh, this isn&#8217;t as silly as it sounds, put the LEDs in a plastic tube (or inside some silicone tubing) and run coolant oil through that, then mount the assembly in place of the CCFLs on a conventional surplus LCD panel as edge lighting.</p>
<p>/me scuttles off to try this&#8230;<br />
Inspired by this and someone&#8217;s PC mod.</p>
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		<title>By: john</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24679</link>
		<dc:creator>john</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Feb 2007 07:12:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24679</guid>
		<description>I bought them a long time ago.. it was from ledsupply.com... I think it was a one man show, always talked to a guy named zak.... he was real helpful..&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;back then they were over $9 each, &amp; theres a special power supply that can run up to 12 of these in series... I use 3 of them... they were around $30 each... I think the prices have come down a bit since then, theres newer stuff out now....&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt; someone mentioned the cree&#039;s.. great lights there, but they weren&#039;t even available back when I did this.... that &amp; you&#039;d never get enough dispersion trying to just use 8 or 12 of them, edge lit maybe, but not rear lit.... &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;optics &amp; projection patterns come into play too, as well as distance... you have to focus an even overlaping pattern or you&#039;ll just have a bunch of hot spots, meaning more diffusion necissary, meaning even less available light&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;something like this could be done with a fan instead of the liquid cooling, if you don&#039;t mind a fan that is... to be totally passive &amp; burried in a dash would require too much surface area of the heatsink, &amp; in a tight spot like that it would eventually get heat soaked, you would at least need some airflow I would think... &lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;these lights are better the cooler you can keep them, &amp; there life span is directly related, as well as there brightness level, which diminishes as there run too hot... mine will last many years &amp; maintain there brightness decently at least....&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;this may be a bit overengineered, but it&#039;s built to last &amp; work well for a long time</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I bought them a long time ago.. it was from ledsupply.com&#8230; I think it was a one man show, always talked to a guy named zak&#8230;. he was real helpful..</p>
<p>back then they were over $9 each, &#038; theres a special power supply that can run up to 12 of these in series&#8230; I use 3 of them&#8230; they were around $30 each&#8230; I think the prices have come down a bit since then, theres newer stuff out now&#8230;.</p>
<p> someone mentioned the cree&#8217;s.. great lights there, but they weren&#8217;t even available back when I did this&#8230;. that &#038; you&#8217;d never get enough dispersion trying to just use 8 or 12 of them, edge lit maybe, but not rear lit&#8230;. </p>
<p>optics &#038; projection patterns come into play too, as well as distance&#8230; you have to focus an even overlaping pattern or you&#8217;ll just have a bunch of hot spots, meaning more diffusion necissary, meaning even less available light</p>
<p>something like this could be done with a fan instead of the liquid cooling, if you don&#8217;t mind a fan that is&#8230; to be totally passive &#038; burried in a dash would require too much surface area of the heatsink, &#038; in a tight spot like that it would eventually get heat soaked, you would at least need some airflow I would think&#8230; </p>
<p>these lights are better the cooler you can keep them, &#038; there life span is directly related, as well as there brightness level, which diminishes as there run too hot&#8230; mine will last many years &#038; maintain there brightness decently at least&#8230;.</p>
<p>this may be a bit overengineered, but it&#8217;s built to last &#038; work well for a long time</p>
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		<title>By: Ice</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24678</link>
		<dc:creator>Ice</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Feb 2007 08:33:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24678</guid>
		<description>It would be awesome if you could post where you got all those luxeons, and how much they cost...&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It would be awesome if you could post where you got all those luxeons, and how much they cost&#8230;</p>
<p>Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: akmixdown</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24677</link>
		<dc:creator>akmixdown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 06 Feb 2007 00:20:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24677</guid>
		<description>awesome writeup on the bezel...  I might have to try this.  :-)  Thanks again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>awesome writeup on the bezel&#8230;  I might have to try this.  :-)  Thanks again.</p>
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		<title>By: john</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24676</link>
		<dc:creator>john</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 03 Feb 2007 23:48:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24676</guid>
		<description>hey guys, thanks for the compliments &amp; critisizims:)&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;akmixdown, you can see the fabrication I did better in another screen that I did:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://mp3car.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=85350&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://mp3car.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=85350&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;also guys, keep in mind that a digital photo isn&#039;t the best way to really see the results of a really bright screen, in person this screen does look great... a regular lcd will be impossible to use in direct sunlight... it can be bad enough that you can&#039;t even tell if it&#039;s on or not even... this mod I did was to be able to see &amp; use the screen even under the brightest conditions, &amp; the end results are that the screen is usable at all times... I can see it during the day even with my sunglasses on, which was the original goal of this project...&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>hey guys, thanks for the compliments &#038; critisizims:)</p>
<p>akmixdown, you can see the fabrication I did better in another screen that I did:</p>
<p><a href="http://mp3car.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=85350" rel="nofollow">http://mp3car.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=85350</a></p>
<p>also guys, keep in mind that a digital photo isn&#8217;t the best way to really see the results of a really bright screen, in person this screen does look great&#8230; a regular lcd will be impossible to use in direct sunlight&#8230; it can be bad enough that you can&#8217;t even tell if it&#8217;s on or not even&#8230; this mod I did was to be able to see &#038; use the screen even under the brightest conditions, &#038; the end results are that the screen is usable at all times&#8230; I can see it during the day even with my sunglasses on, which was the original goal of this project&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: pragma</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24675</link>
		<dc:creator>pragma</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 20:50:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24675</guid>
		<description>@akmixdown:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;From what little I know of automotive repair, working with bondo (bumper putty, etc...) is that it involves a *lot* of wet sanding with fine grit sanding blocks.  It&#039;s easy to screw up, takes a lot of time, and probably as much practice; but it&#039;s also easy to fix mistakes (use more putty).&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I&#039;ve never heard of doing this for interior work, as I reckon it&#039;s messy as hell; so he probably removed the center console bits and did it in a shop.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Another technique is to mold and cast like this guy did:&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://homepage.mac.com/reelmagik1/PhotoAlbum3.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://homepage.mac.com/reelmagik1/PhotoAlbum3.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;(apologies if that&#039;s been posted here before)&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@akmixdown:</p>
<p>From what little I know of automotive repair, working with bondo (bumper putty, etc&#8230;) is that it involves a *lot* of wet sanding with fine grit sanding blocks.  It&#8217;s easy to screw up, takes a lot of time, and probably as much practice; but it&#8217;s also easy to fix mistakes (use more putty).</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve never heard of doing this for interior work, as I reckon it&#8217;s messy as hell; so he probably removed the center console bits and did it in a shop.</p>
<p>Another technique is to mold and cast like this guy did:</p>
<p><a href="http://homepage.mac.com/reelmagik1/PhotoAlbum3.html" rel="nofollow">http://homepage.mac.com/reelmagik1/PhotoAlbum3.html</a></p>
<p>(apologies if that&#8217;s been posted here before)</p>
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		<title>By: akmixdown</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24674</link>
		<dc:creator>akmixdown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 16:06:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24674</guid>
		<description>yeah the comments seem pretty bitter on this one -- I see this guy as a doer and less a talker...  I know I&#039;m a talker, but I get some things done.  My single biggest problem (besides getting over my inertia/laziness and starting to build) is that I *SUCK* at enclosure fabrication and mods.  Does anyone have any decent links on doing the type of thing this guy did with the plastic modification?&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;I can see he built up the areas he cut up with some kind of bumper epoxy and then sanded it down, but there&#039;s got to be more to that, especially when it comes to smooth, straight edges.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>yeah the comments seem pretty bitter on this one &#8212; I see this guy as a doer and less a talker&#8230;  I know I&#8217;m a talker, but I get some things done.  My single biggest problem (besides getting over my inertia/laziness and starting to build) is that I *SUCK* at enclosure fabrication and mods.  Does anyone have any decent links on doing the type of thing this guy did with the plastic modification?</p>
<p>I can see he built up the areas he cut up with some kind of bumper epoxy and then sanded it down, but there&#8217;s got to be more to that, especially when it comes to smooth, straight edges.</p>
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		<title>By: Barry</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24673</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 02:02:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24673</guid>
		<description>I love the comments on this site.  If you guys would actually look at the end of the project, it looks quite good.  He&#039;s not going for theater quality, he wants to be able to still read the thing when the sun is hitting it.  He&#039;s also water cooling it because this car pc is actually a couple pcs and he wants to get as much heat as he can outside the car.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I love the comments on this site.  If you guys would actually look at the end of the project, it looks quite good.  He&#8217;s not going for theater quality, he wants to be able to still read the thing when the sun is hitting it.  He&#8217;s also water cooling it because this car pc is actually a couple pcs and he wants to get as much heat as he can outside the car.</p>
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		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24672</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 00:57:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24672</guid>
		<description>Nothing hard to make such type of lights</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nothing hard to make such type of lights</p>
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		<title>By: Eurisko</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24671</link>
		<dc:creator>Eurisko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 00:30:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24671</guid>
		<description>It wuld cost even *more*, but he should have used Cree 1W LED&#039;s, they produce TWICE as many lumens as the luxeons, but with the same  heat/powerusage. which means either a)he will only need a few, and b) the sky is the limit as far as brightness. The Cree (7090xr-e, i think its called?) can produce 135 lumens/Watt. If he uses only 12 of these babies he&#039;ll have the equivalent of a 100W bulb beaming through his LCD- with practically no heat. Plus, the light array will last for 5 years 7 months of solid runtime (50,000 hour lifespan at full output! From another angle, on any normal LCD screen you could use just 8 to match what his grid produces, with inconsequential power use.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;ps-japroach: luxeons were at that point 35 lumens/watt, they are now 50 (with the Luxeon V).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It wuld cost even *more*, but he should have used Cree 1W LED&#8217;s, they produce TWICE as many lumens as the luxeons, but with the same  heat/powerusage. which means either a)he will only need a few, and b) the sky is the limit as far as brightness. The Cree (7090xr-e, i think its called?) can produce 135 lumens/Watt. If he uses only 12 of these babies he&#8217;ll have the equivalent of a 100W bulb beaming through his LCD- with practically no heat. Plus, the light array will last for 5 years 7 months of solid runtime (50,000 hour lifespan at full output! From another angle, on any normal LCD screen you could use just 8 to match what his grid produces, with inconsequential power use.</p>
<p>ps-japroach: luxeons were at that point 35 lumens/watt, they are now 50 (with the Luxeon V).</p>
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		<title>By: Monkey</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24670</link>
		<dc:creator>Monkey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Feb 2007 00:24:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24670</guid>
		<description>&quot;Hey will its been a month since the contest was over, so i would like to know when are you goning to announce the winner? thanks!&quot;&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;Yeah, I&#039;m interested too! :&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Hey will its been a month since the contest was over, so i would like to know when are you goning to announce the winner? thanks!&#8221;</p>
<p>Yeah, I&#8217;m interested too! :></p>
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		<title>By: nitro2k01</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24669</link>
		<dc:creator>nitro2k01</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Feb 2007 22:27:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24669</guid>
		<description>It&#039;ll certainly be bright enough, but does it have enough contrast?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;ll certainly be bright enough, but does it have enough contrast?</p>
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		<title>By: morcheeba</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24668</link>
		<dc:creator>morcheeba</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Feb 2007 20:37:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24668</guid>
		<description>I think the reason for the water cooling is to make sure that the LEDs will work in a 125-150 degree F ambient temperature. Also, you don&#039;t want to heat the LCD unevenly, or you&#039;ll get spots. Plus, a good portion of his work is install time... it&#039;s often best to overbuild it so that if there&#039;s a problem, you won&#039;t have to rip it up, rework it, and reinstall it later. Watercooling makes sense for constrained places &amp; to keep noise down.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;A bonus of the LEDs is that they can provide a wider color gamut over CCFL. That would partially depend on the color filters in the LCD, but I&#039;m sure the results would look stunning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the reason for the water cooling is to make sure that the LEDs will work in a 125-150 degree F ambient temperature. Also, you don&#8217;t want to heat the LCD unevenly, or you&#8217;ll get spots. Plus, a good portion of his work is install time&#8230; it&#8217;s often best to overbuild it so that if there&#8217;s a problem, you won&#8217;t have to rip it up, rework it, and reinstall it later. Watercooling makes sense for constrained places &#038; to keep noise down.</p>
<p>A bonus of the LEDs is that they can provide a wider color gamut over CCFL. That would partially depend on the color filters in the LCD, but I&#8217;m sure the results would look stunning.</p>
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		<title>By: Pokey</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24667</link>
		<dc:creator>Pokey</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Feb 2007 18:57:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24667</guid>
		<description>Of course he did, akmixdown.  If I spent $500 in LEDs for a project I&#039;d say that the result looks nothing less than stunning.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Of course he did, akmixdown.  If I spent $500 in LEDs for a project I&#8217;d say that the result looks nothing less than stunning.</p>
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		<title>By: akmixdown</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/comment-page-1/#comment-24666</link>
		<dc:creator>akmixdown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Feb 2007 18:06:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.iheartcashews.com:8181/2007/01/31/watercooled-led-backlit-lcd/#comment-24666</guid>
		<description>jimmy-the-fish: he said he tried multiple CCFLs and had trouble getting multi-tube inverters/dimmers working right.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;In the end he went with a boe-hydis HT12X21-210 wide-angle LCD, which he claims he doesn&#039;t even have to use the LED mod for, but when he does it looks *stunning*.&lt;br&gt;&lt;br&gt;He doesn&#039;t sound like someone who is arrogant to me... but anyway.&lt;br&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>jimmy-the-fish: he said he tried multiple CCFLs and had trouble getting multi-tube inverters/dimmers working right.</p>
<p>In the end he went with a boe-hydis HT12X21-210 wide-angle LCD, which he claims he doesn&#8217;t even have to use the LED mod for, but when he does it looks *stunning*.</p>
<p>He doesn&#8217;t sound like someone who is arrogant to me&#8230; but anyway.</p>
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