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	<title>Comments on: 25C3: Hackers completely break SSL using 200 PS3s</title>
	<atom:link href="http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/</link>
	<description>Fresh hacks every day</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 24 Nov 2009 10:00:44 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<item>
		<title>By: Confused.com</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-104656</link>
		<dc:creator>Confused.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Oct 2009 20:08:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-104656</guid>
		<description>Why operate so close to the technological boundary? Are we so tight with storage and processing power that we can&#039;t put MD5 and SHA together so a collision requires collisions in both.

My guess is that would be safe for our lifetime...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why operate so close to the technological boundary? Are we so tight with storage and processing power that we can&#8217;t put MD5 and SHA together so a collision requires collisions in both.</p>
<p>My guess is that would be safe for our lifetime&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: cctv</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-91710</link>
		<dc:creator>cctv</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Sep 2009 09:33:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-91710</guid>
		<description>&quot;~$20K of Amazon EC2 time.&quot;

One PS3 is 300$, they used 200 of them which makes 60.000$. They could have bought 3 times the EC2 time and then be over with it, i really hope the ps3 found a good home after the test finished. Good work though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;~$20K of Amazon EC2 time.&#8221;</p>
<p>One PS3 is 300$, they used 200 of them which makes 60.000$. They could have bought 3 times the EC2 time and then be over with it, i really hope the ps3 found a good home after the test finished. Good work though.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: filtermd</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-88440</link>
		<dc:creator>filtermd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 21 Aug 2009 17:00:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-88440</guid>
		<description>Posted at 9:49 am on Dec 30th, 2008 by epicelite
&gt;Well lets hope bad people cannot afford 200 PS3’s.

yeah, most of us can&#039;t :-/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Posted at 9:49 am on Dec 30th, 2008 by epicelite<br />
&gt;Well lets hope bad people cannot afford 200 PS3’s.</p>
<p>yeah, most of us can&#8217;t :-/</p>
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		<title>By: zz</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-77117</link>
		<dc:creator>zz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Jun 2009 14:46:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-77117</guid>
		<description>http://www.baidu.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://www.baidu.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.baidu.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: randall5</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-76726</link>
		<dc:creator>randall5</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 30 May 2009 07:21:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-76726</guid>
		<description>im more interested in what they do with the ps3s when they arent using them for hacking... thatd be a sweet entertainment room</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>im more interested in what they do with the ps3s when they arent using them for hacking&#8230; thatd be a sweet entertainment room</p>
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		<title>By: hazed</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-63051</link>
		<dc:creator>hazed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Feb 2009 10:13:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-63051</guid>
		<description>Wow. That&#039;s some really expensive phishing right there. I can&#039;t afford one PS3 and they hacked together something like this with 200. Sha can&#039;t possibly be used as a solution in it&#039;s current state. It&#039;s just as broken as MD5.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow. That&#8217;s some really expensive phishing right there. I can&#8217;t afford one PS3 and they hacked together something like this with 200. Sha can&#8217;t possibly be used as a solution in it&#8217;s current state. It&#8217;s just as broken as MD5.</p>
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		<title>By: A.hacker</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-61386</link>
		<dc:creator>A.hacker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Jan 2009 23:53:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-61386</guid>
		<description>You could do that using a Tesla desktop supercomputer now, probably quicker too.

md5 is dead.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You could do that using a Tesla desktop supercomputer now, probably quicker too.</p>
<p>md5 is dead.</p>
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		<title>By: Zypher</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-60760</link>
		<dc:creator>Zypher</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jan 2009 08:27:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-60760</guid>
		<description>@ J
lulz</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ J<br />
lulz</p>
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		<title>By: firedward</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-60721</link>
		<dc:creator>firedward</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Jan 2009 23:01:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-60721</guid>
		<description>basically yes. i wonder if i could use this to defend my website from goverment initrusion?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>basically yes. i wonder if i could use this to defend my website from goverment initrusion?</p>
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		<title>By: Michaelangelo</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-60598</link>
		<dc:creator>Michaelangelo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Jan 2009 22:13:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-60598</guid>
		<description>SO your telling me if I buy 200 hundred Ps3&#039;s I don&#039;t have to buy a rapidshare account!!! Score!!...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SO your telling me if I buy 200 hundred Ps3&#8217;s I don&#8217;t have to buy a rapidshare account!!! Score!!&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: WulfTheSaxon</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-58710</link>
		<dc:creator>WulfTheSaxon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jan 2009 03:41:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-58710</guid>
		<description>@sam

The NSA&#039;s tweak appears to be justified. See, for example, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA#SHA-0_and_SHA-1

However, I&#039;d tend to avoid SHA-1 anyway. It&#039;s been shown to be a bit flawed, and I don&#039;t really see any barrier to adoption of SHA-256. Work is beginning on SHA-3 -- it&#039;s long past time to ditch even SHA-1.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@sam</p>
<p>The NSA&#8217;s tweak appears to be justified. See, for example, <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA#SHA-0_and_SHA-1" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHA#SHA-0_and_SHA-1</a></p>
<p>However, I&#8217;d tend to avoid SHA-1 anyway. It&#8217;s been shown to be a bit flawed, and I don&#8217;t really see any barrier to adoption of SHA-256. Work is beginning on SHA-3 &#8212; it&#8217;s long past time to ditch even SHA-1.</p>
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		<title>By: julius</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-58310</link>
		<dc:creator>julius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 12:59:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-58310</guid>
		<description>No teneis ni puta idea de lo que estáis hablando. Sacado del documento original:

The vulnerability we expose is not in the SSL protocol or the web servers and browsers that implement it, but in the Public Key Infrastructure. This infrastructure has applications in other areas than the web, but we have not investigated all other possible attack scenarios. So other attack scenarios beyond the web are conceivable, such as in the areas of code signing, e-mail security, and in other areas that use certificates for enabling digital signatures or public key encryption.

A leer más, chicos!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No teneis ni puta idea de lo que estáis hablando. Sacado del documento original:</p>
<p>The vulnerability we expose is not in the SSL protocol or the web servers and browsers that implement it, but in the Public Key Infrastructure. This infrastructure has applications in other areas than the web, but we have not investigated all other possible attack scenarios. So other attack scenarios beyond the web are conceivable, such as in the areas of code signing, e-mail security, and in other areas that use certificates for enabling digital signatures or public key encryption.</p>
<p>A leer más, chicos!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Blind</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-3/#comment-58270</link>
		<dc:creator>Blind</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jan 2009 03:10:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-58270</guid>
		<description>@error404

That doesn&#039;t change what I said.  MD5 was developed to be a hash.  They knew that there would be collisions.  This was accepted.  MD5 was never broken.  This doesn&#039;t break MD5.  This shows that MD5 works the way it&#039;s been expected to work.  MD5 does not generate a unique hash for every unique input.  That is impossible.  That was never the point of MD5.  MD5 is not an encryption.  It&#039;s a way to encode something, pass a short string (the hash) and you can then quickly check if the encoded string is probably correct.

To use an example.  You have a password on your system.  The system stores the password and the MD5 hash of the password.  When you enter a password on your system, it first generates an MD5 of the inputed password and compares that to the stored MD5.  This is a very fast comparison for various reasons that we don&#039;t need to get into.  If the hashes dont&#039; match, you return invalid password.  If the hashes do match you can either then do the slower comparison and confirm that the inputted and stored passwords match.

That is how MD5 is supposed to be used (one of the ways at least).

Or you send data appended with an MD5 hash generated by the data and a secret key (like the timestamp of the send).  The recieving end has bot the data and the secret key and can calc a new MD5 hash and use that as a quick check that the data most likely has arrived correctly.

MD5 was never expected to be a 1 for 1, unique hash for every possible input.  That&#039;s impossible. They&#039;ve known that for years.  It was always just good enough.   This doesn&#039;t break anything because there was never anything to break (with regard to MD5).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@error404</p>
<p>That doesn&#8217;t change what I said.  MD5 was developed to be a hash.  They knew that there would be collisions.  This was accepted.  MD5 was never broken.  This doesn&#8217;t break MD5.  This shows that MD5 works the way it&#8217;s been expected to work.  MD5 does not generate a unique hash for every unique input.  That is impossible.  That was never the point of MD5.  MD5 is not an encryption.  It&#8217;s a way to encode something, pass a short string (the hash) and you can then quickly check if the encoded string is probably correct.</p>
<p>To use an example.  You have a password on your system.  The system stores the password and the MD5 hash of the password.  When you enter a password on your system, it first generates an MD5 of the inputed password and compares that to the stored MD5.  This is a very fast comparison for various reasons that we don&#8217;t need to get into.  If the hashes dont&#8217; match, you return invalid password.  If the hashes do match you can either then do the slower comparison and confirm that the inputted and stored passwords match.</p>
<p>That is how MD5 is supposed to be used (one of the ways at least).</p>
<p>Or you send data appended with an MD5 hash generated by the data and a secret key (like the timestamp of the send).  The recieving end has bot the data and the secret key and can calc a new MD5 hash and use that as a quick check that the data most likely has arrived correctly.</p>
<p>MD5 was never expected to be a 1 for 1, unique hash for every possible input.  That&#8217;s impossible. They&#8217;ve known that for years.  It was always just good enough.   This doesn&#8217;t break anything because there was never anything to break (with regard to MD5).</p>
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		<title>By: mike</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-2/#comment-57999</link>
		<dc:creator>mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 19:41:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-57999</guid>
		<description>about:config does not stop it I tried it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>about:config does not stop it I tried it.</p>
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		<title>By: Al Billings</title>
		<link>http://hackaday.com/2008/12/30/25c3-hackers-completely-break-ssl-using-200-ps3s/comment-page-2/#comment-57930</link>
		<dc:creator>Al Billings</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 05 Jan 2009 02:36:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hackaday.com/?p=7367#comment-57930</guid>
		<description>By the way, if you&#039;re going to refer to companies by name (like &quot;Microsoft&quot;), there is no company called &quot;Firefox&quot; out there. The name of the company is &quot;Mozilla&quot; as Firefox is just the web browser.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>By the way, if you&#8217;re going to refer to companies by name (like &#8220;Microsoft&#8221;), there is no company called &#8220;Firefox&#8221; out there. The name of the company is &#8220;Mozilla&#8221; as Firefox is just the web browser.</p>
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