You thought we forgot about your favorite Hackaday comment game, didn’t you? Well, not only is ‘Real or Fake?’ back with a new installment, but this time it concerns everybody’s favorite impossibility: perpetual motion machines! It’s likely that you’ve already seen the photos of Brazilian energy group RAR Energia’s generator “powered exclusively by gravity” (translated). If you’re rolling your eyes and exclaiming “this is so last year..” you might want to scroll down to the bottom of the page; they’re still building this monstrosity and they’ve included some diagram images. Perhaps someone who reads Portuguese can better translate the claim that the devices are “demonstration models with capacity to generate 30kW.” Oh, didn’t you know? There are two of them now: one in Brazil that is presumably functioning, and a second under construction in Gilman, Illinois.
Now, before you all scream “Photoshopped,” take a gander at a FotoForensics analysis of one of the images, where ELA (error level analysis) seems to indicate consistent levels of compression. EXIF data shows the pictures were shot with a Sony DSC-WX5 and saved in PhotoScape. It may be simpler than that: you can easily recognize the same employees in different shots from different angles, and there are quite a lot of photos. RAR Energia’s most recent endeavor—a second machine in Gilman Illinois—seems to have been erected in the past two months. The Gilman warehouse is located on property belonging to bio-diesel manufacturing firm Incobrasa Industries (named a “Company of the [RAR Energia] group” on the RAR Energia site). Here’s a little internet sleuthing for your consideration: a photo of the completed warehouse and a Google maps link to the location in question (40.763176, -88.012706). Note the distinctly shaped building in the background (another view here, during construction), which can be found due south of the location indicated in the Google maps link. We’re not suggesting that you completely rule out image manipulation, but if it’s Photoshopped, it’s a damned elaborate job.
Unfortunately, there aren’t any videos demonstrating motion or any explanation for how the system works other than vagaries about perpetual energy. So, does this thing exist—and did this company really build two of them? Does it work…or, well, somehow do something?
I am Brazilian, and my curiosity made me check their site and their company. I was so amazed by that marvelous and ingenious technology that all I have to say to you, unfaithful souls, is this:
Those guys are crazy as f*ck. Or this is a massive scam that consumes tons of iron and steel.
At first, I thought it was some kind of machine to do anything else, like a badass olive stone remover, and someone was making a big joke. Then I checked the company (RAR Energia), and it is registered as “physics research”. No one would register a company just to make a joke.
Just occurred me that maybe it is indeed a machine. A money launderer machine. Think with me: first, you have a steel company called “A”, and loads of money to wash; then you open a “research company” called “B” which demands a lot of steel; as the Company B, you get *your* money, saying it was an “anonymous investor donation for research”, and buys steel from *your* Company A; then the “experiment” goes wrong, and Company B is dismantled. Maybe Company A even buy Company B’s scrap metal by a ridiculous low price.
I am curious to see this monstrosity operate. I got a unique eye. But it is very feasible. That is to close to a prototype i made but for cars and homes not hole cities.
Something like this
http://youtu.be/_K26jNBq6uM
Amazing! The machine works so well that it still have enough energy to move that guy’s hand!
LOL…..
I think people are over analysing and assuming that the weights are moving back to their starting positions under their own power, which they may not be so without seeing it moving. They could be lifted via horse power or wind mills or even off-peak electricity and this is simple a way of storing potential energy for all any of you know. It may not be the most efficient way of storing energy, but maybe its better than a huge ass lake or something for a small area? I’ve seen flywheel based UPS system ideas kicked around before, where a huge, heavy wheel is kept spinning by a small motor, and when the power fails, the wheel will keep spinning, and the motor becomes a generator and keeps things powered on. Sounds crazy sure, but it works. After all, hydroelectricity is a “gravity generator”…
Ok, having actually looked at the webpage and read as much of the translated stuff as possible, yeah, these guys DO think they are going to be generating power from nothing, perptually, not just storing it… Not gonna happen.
I can guess (since I am Brazilian) that this company will sell market shares of this impossible dream until they can, declare bankruptcy, and anjoy all of that fools’s money, wich is quite common and easy in Brazil
you know nothing about brazil. sell shares… pffft
they will get a huge government grant.
we all know this is crap … why are we talking about this?
Please,. hackaday .. you are better than this.
What, we can’t speculate the crap outa dis?!
Fun article IMO.
Brazilian lol…. from that side of the ocean only comes a lot of sad news and handfull of loles… It is a PM machine as long as you have someone cycling each “hour” to make it move.. Now seriously, it should be a hi torque motor, that work with a small torque one, a kind of torque amplifier, and someone thought he could prank some people by saying that it is a PM..
jokes.br jajjajaj
by the way, portuguese here
To those who say perpetual motion is impossible, please explain why the electrons keep their movement constantly. It is everywhere around us…
the only fact is that humans are not ready or simply are not able to copy the model.
Is there anybody that doesn´t agree with that??
Electrons in the shells of atoms don’t really move in the Newtonian sense. They do however, change location when no one is looking.
My money (not that I would ever give any, unlike some poor sap obviously has) is on this being a working kinetic sculpture, and there’s a very practical reason it’s so big. It’s so that it has enough momentum for the crankshaft to drive something small after it’s spun up without there being any apparent loss of velocity in the movement of the machine. Therefore it’s an integral aprt of its function (of duping free energy folk).
http://patent.ipexl.com/inventor/Renato_Bastos_Ribeiro_1.html
here is the list of patents from the inventor/company owner.
Oh gods, he’s a respected inventor with 10 patents to his name! Although about 8 of them are for an under-represented sector of perpetual motion machines, the buoyancy type.
it is mostly ridiculed in brazil. defenders of the idea point to this successful perpetual motion machine
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPlkhyH4Vcw
when they finally fire this up, it’ll get up and walk out of the building like a strandbeest and quite possibly overthrow the US government. this isn’t perpetual motion, it is a stealth killing machine.
If friction is the reason why everyone says PM can’t work, someone needs to announce a PM machine powered by friction. That would lead to some new, more interesting comments. :-)
LOL Steam engine along time ago. let them be skeptics, and dream the impossible like i do. There arguments are just speed bumps to me.
I’d love to see that thing in motion, its like a strandbeest of steel. Would be a cool band name, though.
Anyway, if such a thing would actually produce energy, it have to pull it from somewhere. Lets say Coriolis force. A machine producing energy by slowing down the Earth’s rotation. That would make such an awesome end-of-the-world scenario!
Coriolis force is a very cool hypothetical explanation. And I like the end of world idea. By the same token… tidal generators are robbing momentum from the moon’s orbit. Don’t de-orbit the moon!!! One day, instead of selling carbon-credits, maybe we’ll sell lunar-momentum credits.
Now I want to go around and troll green-energy websites.
Lol, and in a century or so it will be Jupiter-momentum credits!
You can get energy in two ways from the earth’s momentum – by slowing it down and by speeding it up.
The situation is analogous to the action of a Stirling Engine which can obtain energy from cooling a hot source or by warming a cold source. It’s the difference that is important.
As a brazilian I have to give you all non-bannana eaters an adivise:
-NEVER trust a brazilian.
That’s the rule.
You know how clock makers have been improving the design of clocks for centuries? Why then do pendulum clocks still need a push every so often?
I believe it works.
How? By harnessing 3rd derivative energy – by generating gravitationally induced angular momentum which is conserved by the rotation of the crankshaft.
In effect it’s a greatly scaled down version of the sling-shot effect. If you read the history of the sling-shot you will find that no one believed that either.
So maybe its not a perfect PM machine because that’s impossible. But so what if once a week they have to pay some guy an american dollar to ride a mule in and give a crank another good turn and shoot a couple hi friction points with wd-40.
You may think it’s impossible, PF, but it isn’t as RAR will show.
The issue hear is not PM. Issue is can this devise utilise the force of gravity? Perpetual Motion would imply that the devise would utilise energy perfectly but gravity is a additional force or energy. So it is possible to use gravity. Is it easy to use Gravity? NO!!!!! You could think of gravity as a vacum with out pressure difereces and the suction is at the centre of the earth. All day we use energy fight gravitation energy. Has this device found a way to capture gravitational energy? I have not yet seen a credible design but this dosent mean it is immposible!!!!!!! I do have some ideas but only time will tell if they work.
“You could think of gravity as a vacuum with out pressure differences and the suction is at the centre of the earth.”
You can also think of gravity as a wind blowing vertically downwards.
OK honestly, we are living on a living engine called earth. Studying her is key to this. And how our solar system evolves. Will ultimately tell you this… I already know how to make one, it generated unlimited energy beyond my ability to handle and rip it self apart. Funny thing is it looks remarkably similar to the one in brazil. But mine was much smaller, and we need be careful with anything bigger would only be a WMD. It would in essence be able to warp the earths magnetic field to cause earth quacks any where in the world.
I became interested in perpetual motion in 1979, and later started a R&D business (Gravtronics [Australia]) funded by my software business. My first prototype (MK1) encountered problems, FRICTION that could be reduced but NOT eliminated. Hence, back to the drawing board. The Gravitron MK1 was a failure with design scrapped. However, I approached the problem from another direction, and one that may interest some readers here. Note I never took the Gravitron MK2 to prototype, but I believe the principle is sound.
Here is the basic design:
[M1]———-[M3]———-[M2]
M1 = M2
M1 + M3 > M2
M2 + M3 > M1
M3 is a floating mass. When either M1 or M2 hits bottom then M3 will float in opposite direction with use of gears. This enables the Gravitron to remain top heavy. I trust no explanation is required as to why. Note friction would still exist but in this design would not hinder its function.
It is a half-baked ocean wave, crankshaft mechanism to power an electricity generator.
To be pedantic, water mills are genuine ‘gravity powered generators’ (the river runs downhill to get the energy).