While electric vehicles (EVs) are generally less likely to catch fire than their internal combustion counterparts, it does still happen, and firefighters need to be ready. Accordingly, the UL Research Institute is working with reverse engineering experts Munro & Associates to characterize EV fires and find the best way to fight them.
There is currently some debate in the firefighting community over whether it’s better to try to put an EV battery fire out with water or to just let it burn. Research like this means the decision doesn’t have to fall on only anecdotal evidence. Anyone who’s worked in a lab will recognize the mix of exceedingly expensive equipment next to the borderline sketchy rigged up hacks on display, in this case the super nice thermal imagers and a “turkey burner on steroids.” The video goes through some discussion of the previous results with a Chevy Bolt, Hyundai Kona, Ford Mustang Mach E, and then we get to see them light up a Tesla Model 3. This is definitely one you shouldn’t try at home!
While the massive battery banks in modern EVs can pose unique challenges in the event of an accident, that doesn’t mean they can’t be repurposed to backup your own home.
At the moment they’re less likely to ignite, give it another 10-20 years of aging wiring, electronics, batteries and shade tree mechanics then grab the marshmallows.
that’s true of any vehicle, my dad had a 1998 Dodge Dakota in like 2010 or so it busted a fuel line and burned to the ground in the middle of his (long thank goodness) driveway
Chances are that the balance will tip the other way as fossil fueled cars vanish or become extremely well maintained collector items and the ageing fleet of vehicles becomes majority EV with all the bodges and shoddy repairs, for example the aftermarket battery repair services I’ve seen right now terrify me, just wait until Jimbob is doing his own duct tape and visegrip job.
“Reverse engineering experts” when the EV makers should be working with them.
In the video, the emphasis is put on the independent validation. You hear several anecdotes, but these are not independently verified. An EV maker may know their own models very well, but Munro worked on many different vehicles. Their reports are used to develop methods to repair battery packs rather than simply replacing them. This in itself isn’t in the best interest of the manufacturers, who prefer you just to trust them. Munro’s knowledge is independent and of great value, and highly appreciated by UL in this case.
“characterize EV fires and find the best way to fight them.”
Using a large lithium-ion battery safely is like trying to keep a pyramid balanced on its point. So long as you do that, they work great. The issue is what happens when, either through internal failure or external factors, the pyramid topples off its point.
The best way to prevent an EV fire is to NOT store 75 KWH of electrical energy in a high-density package that is not only prone to assault by temperature extremes, water ingress, and mechanical shock/damage, but is intrinsically unstable to boot. “How can you have an EV and not do that?” you might ask. Well, you just answered your own question.
I’m a big fan of electric drive trains. Somebody call me when a production-ready electric, with a fuel tank and fuel cells, becomes available and affordable (without government subsidies).
fuel cells in vehicles either suck by their nature or make little sense…hydrocarbons are better utilized with existing heat engines. Green hydrogen performs worse then batteries because of conversion losses and is a pain in the ass to store and transport. Also knowing you’re literally sitting atop a tank with an operating pressure of up to 80MPa certainly wouldn’t give me a warm fuzzy feeling…
Agreed. I’m not a fan of hydrogen fuel cells for commuter-car use. I was thinking more along the lines of a perfected ethanol or methanol fuel cell.
hydrocarbon…
oh and the study is about what to do with an EV that’s already on fire, not how to keep them from igniting :P
A way to have an EV and not do that would just be to use a safer battery chemistry. There are more dangerous chemistries too such as li-po that aren’t used in production EVs for the same reason (although they’re commonly used in consumer electronics). But the fire stats indicate that li-ion and lifepo are safe enough. Some new safer chemistries such as solid-state lithium and dual-carbon should hit the market soon. Nimh and lead-acid are safe enough too, although their energy density is too low to make a practical EV.
I haven’t watched the video but I’ve long thought that a good way to fight EV fires would be with the addition of a flatbed crane truck with a junkyard-style claw end that also carries one or more lightweight foldable dumpsters. If one of these arrives on the scene of an EV fire, it can deploy the dumpster and let a fire truck start filling it, and then it uses the claw to pick up the flaming car and drop it in the dumpster. The immersion will stop or at least safely contain the fire, and the truck can then lift the whole dumpster onto the flatbed, and the car can be left immersed until enough time has passed that the battery energy would’ve been dissipated as heat.
On a related note I’ve also thought that a battery ejection system would be a good way to mitigate the safety problems of a li-po powered EV. If springs or pneumatic pistons could push the pack clear of the car through the side or rear, not only would the rest of the car be saved but any people inside would automatically be clear of the fire as well. This would require a battery that’s not integrated into the chassis so tightly which should be more practical with a better energy density.
“battery ejection system”…light a fire, receive a $20k battery…nope, can’t see that being abused :D
You do realise that fuel cells and fuel tanks are just as problematic if you don’t treat them right – the whole point is to move a vehicle a long way, which means storing lots of energy. Doesn’t matter how you store it there will be some danger involved with an unplanned release of than energy… In the case of deliberately combustible by design fuels that is one heck of an incendiary bomb that can easily make the EV battery look like nothing – likely vastly more potential energy in a very small dense package vs a large EV battery full of stuff much of which isn’t even easy fuel for the fire…
Design, build and then maintain a Lithium pack right it is just as safe if not safer than than liquid fuels as the fire if it ever happens can’t be carried by the flowing fuel leak over vast areas trivially – its one focused spot of somewhat annoying to properly and permanently extinguish fire vs the potential for a fire that spreads really darn easy… The only thing that makes a EV fire such a big news item now is because it is an EV and so many folks have vested interest in highlighting every time one of those ‘new’ contraptions burns, but just flat out won’t mention all the other burning cars at all!
So yes as research like this rather shows there is a need to find best practices for when shit happens for this newer breed of somewhat dangerous power source. But don’t get carried away or pretend all the other sources are actually safe, they are just a danger folks have gotten so used to it isn’t even worth getting excited about even when it is happening practically on your doorstep, as for the last few hundred years those fires have happened and been dealt with…
Obviously the best way is with fire!