Sony removes PS3 Linux support with an update… errrrr, downgrade?

Sony is rolling out a firmware update for the PS3 on April 1 but we’re pretty sure it’s not a joke. What we’re not sure about is that you can call it an update. It removes features rather than fixing or adding them. In this case, it is removing the “Install Other OS” option that allows you to run Linux on non-slim versions of the PlayStation 3. It is fairly obvious that this is a reaction to the hypervisor exploit that was released back in January that breaks down the machine’s security barriers.

[Geohot], the guy who found and release the exploit, published a post on his blog expressing his disapproval of Sony’s actions. We’d have to agree. It’s pretty cold-hearted to remove functionality that was advertised with a product. We’re sure there are many folks out there using the Linux support who have no interest in exploiting the product. This is gardening with a backhoe and quite frankly it stinks.

This may bring on a torrent of new effort in unlocking and laying bare the PS3. If so, doesn’t Sony deserve it?

[Photos credit: I'm with Stupid]

[Thanks Shueddue]

Comments

  1. Cole says:

    @spyder_21 companies way bigger than sony have thought they had their asses covered but fucked up. just because they have some little legal bullshit they think is going to cover their asses doesn’t necessarily mean that it will work. You can’t force someone into agreeing to something they don’t want, and that’s what sony did. I was forced to delete linux, because if not, I wouldn’t be able to game. And trust me, I play ALOT of games. Now I remember the ads when they came out, I payed over 600 bux for my ps3 because I got it when it was first released to the public in America. It was defiantly an advertised feature, but just on the chance that I may possibly be mistaken, it was still 100% a feature that was sold with the machine. Any gaming system is like around 200-300 bux, you don’t pay 600 some odd dollars for a gaming system, you do pay that much if it doubles over as a PC. No one would have spent that much money on simply a gaming console with blu ray player. More than losing linux, I’m pissed because I don’t like being screwed over, and this is screwing me over along with alot of other people. The PC I’m on now is CRAP and my ps3 was a hell of alot better, now i’m back on this slow ass machine cuz they took linux away. I’ve seen bigger companies than sony get hit with lawsuits and lose, so it won’t surprise me if sony didn’t cover their asses as well as they thought they did. Maybe with the paper work they did a good job, but its still illegal to force me to update, or penalize for not agreeing to the new terms.

  2. Kirk says:

    I agree that Sony did screw customers that bought the PS3 for Linux support and that is wrong. But, I find it hilarious that some of the comments are about how the Wii and 360 outsell the PS3 because Sony does things like this. Um, the Wii and 360 never supported Linux… and they outsold the PS3. I will laugh my ass off if the PS3 ends up outselling the Wii and 360 after removing this feature. Then we’ll have further proof that Linux is a plague upon all who support it!

  3. Cole says:

    if windows 7 came with ps3 instead of linux, and all the idiots who don’t know how to work linux could still use ps3 as a computer, this would piss off a lot more people. Linux is awesome if you have the right version and you know what you’re doing. I’m still learning and I love linux, even with the frustrations that come with it.

  4. Kirk says:

    “I’m still learning and I love linux, even with the frustrations that come with it.”

    Yup, Linux sure is awesome with the frustrations and all.

    It never ceases to amaze me how loyal Linux users are. Kinda like someone in an abusive relationship.

  5. Mark Dixon says:

    Ha ha ha. My original PS3 broke so now I have to buy a slim. Son of a ….

  6. ILCASTE says:

    hey guys, the facts that Sony’s removing the feature to install Linux is a “great thing” coz it indicates that we are on the right way to finally hack the ps3… it seems that geohot has found a real exploit, and soon “i hope” a CF will be relased, once we get a CF sony wont break our b—ls anymore. but its real that sony cannot remove features that you have paid… legally thay can, but there’s no justice anymore…. ps plz excuse my horrible henglish, im italian…

  7. Cole says:

    @ ILCASTE

    lol, spell check is built into everything now :)

    I’m Italian-American but was born and raised in the US.

    @Mark Dixon

    Don’t buy a slim, get another old one from da pawn shop lol.

    @Kirk..

    all I can say is lmao

  8. bobcollum says:

    It never ceases to amaze me how loyal Linux users are. Kinda like someone in an abusive relationship.
    Posted at 6:07 pm on Apr 5th, 2010 by Kirk
    —————–

    Yeah, you’re an idiot. Stick to things you know about, that’s what I always say.

  9. bothersaidpooh says:

    Um.. at the very least the update should have checked for the presence of a linux partition before proceeding.

    Sony have blatantly broken the Computer Misuse Act (in the UK) by “denying access to a machine or data”

    Of course, thanks to the convenient dissolving of Parliament this probably won’t get dealt with for months if at all.

    Just my $0.02 worth.

    (another disgruntled Sony product owner)

  10. PocketBrain says:

    I wonder how long until they disable the Emotion Engine chip on the older PS3s?

  11. Kirk says:

    @bobbiecollum:

    “Yeah, you’re an idiot. Stick to things you know about, that’s what I always say.”

    I know Linux. That’s why I haven’t stuck with it.

  12. bobcollum says:

    “Then we’ll have further proof that Linux is a plague upon all who support it!” – Kirk

    How in the hell did you conclude that the ps3 sales numbers will go up after removing the option to install another OS? If you had no intention of using it in the first place why would you care whether the option was there or not? Why would those who would use it want a ps3 more so after the option was removed? Whaaa?

    Linux isn’t easy for sure, frustrating, yeah it can be to someone who is new to it, or even those that have moderate experience with it…but it wasn’t made with the goal of being very user-friendly…and to call it a “plague” is outlandish, and a little insulting. At first I thought you were just confusing Linux with every Windows OS in existence…now that is a truly abusive relationship. You may not care for it or the experiences that it has provided for you, and that’s fine, to each his own. But I know there are loads of experienced Linux operators that would give your argument quite a run for it’s money. If your’s was the general consensus Linux wouldn’t exist today, because nobody would be using it.

    I thought, and continue to think your statements are that of someone who didn’t want to try too hard to figure it out, and just gave up. Understandable…sure, just don’t paint your generalizations with such a broad stroke, ok Kirkiepooh?

  13. Kirk says:

    But Bobbie, mine is the general consensus. That is why Linux has such a poor market share.

  14. bobcollum says:

    Yeah, i’m shocked the low man on the totem pole is the one that requires the most thought and training. How come noobs don’t gravitate more to that attractive and robust terminal? Who are these apparent retards that continue to create distros, programs, drivers, and/or apps, all of which are open-source? Why are you here? You should be elsewhere spreading the word, because apparently there are a lot of folks who have been wasting their lives with Linux. When they could have been enjoying Windows XP.

    Does the Mac OS X suck too? I’ve never used it, but it only has 5% market share as of about 6 months ago…based on your logic, it’s only slightly less of a plague than Linux, and can’t touch the healthy Vista OS at 22%.

    Windows XP however is the king at 68%, so therefore it undoubtedly is the least problematic OS out there, again based on your logic.

  15. Kirk says:

    Bobbie, it’s irrelevant whether or not the market is correct about the Linux experience. I was simply responding to your comment where you claimed that there wasn’t a general consensus about Linux providing a poor user experience. There is a general consensus as the 1% market share for Linux clearly demonstrates. Those are the figures you’ve provided.

    I don’t care what operating system people use, but I find it rather amusing that Linux zealots do – to the point that they get into a huff when someone says something negative about their sacred cow.

  16. bobcollum says:

    Whatever Kirk, you called it a plague, and you’re wrong. If you don’t want to deal with it you don’t have to, as you have stated. You sound like a bitter ex-spouse…and you claim that a 1% share equates to a general consensus that Linux is a problem…where I think it’s more indicative of the majority of computer users being noobs to mildly tech savvy, which will undoubtedly affect your abilities on any Linux os. Who cares about the general consensus when generally most people have little idea of how to work with it? It was your poor choice of words that got me into a huff, not the fact that you’ve chosen something other than Linux. If you and a girl have a bad break-up and you then attempt to label her as a whore, her friends will probably take exception to it if it’s unjustified.

    Agree, don’t agree, I don’t care. I’m done with this discussion.

  17. Kirk says:

    @Bobbie

    “Who cares about the general consensus when generally most people have little idea of how to work with it?”

    Apparently 99% of the market cares. I think they care about not having an idea of how to work something that should be simple. But, thanks for finally acknowleging that there is a general consensus that Linux provides a poor user experience.

    I’m just greatful that cars aren’t designed like Linux. Can you imagine all the “noobs” that would be driving those things off of bridges and stuff? Oh my.

  18. People realize that 99% of the PS3 purchasing population did NOT buy it to be used as a cheap computer. Something for that already exists; They’re called “cheap computers”. No, people bought PS3’s to, get this, play PS3 games and blu-ray movies.

    The fact that Linux support was even offered to begin with was a total ruse; Nothing but a bone thrown to attract the geek crowd and a bullet point on their feature list. Their support for it was practically non-existent from the beginning.

    They realized the primary reason Linux was installed was to pirate games and cut into their bottom line. If you found out the neighbourhood kids were sneaking in and stealing food from your fridge, you’d probably start locking the front door too.

    Sorry to the ten or so people who foolishly bought a gaming console to be a home computer, but you got duped. The fact that you didn’t see this coming a mile away leaves little in the way of pity, though. Next time, buy a real computer if you want to mess around with operating systems and let the console play its games.

  19. tdurden 3828 says:

    @bobcollum

    No Kirk is right, Linux sucks.

    Linux is free and had been on the market for over a decade and yet it has been flatlined at 1% the entire time.

    Your software has a serious problem when you can’t give it away.

  20. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    @Posted at 5:21 pm on Apr 7th, 2010 by bobcollum

    LinuxMakesYouSmart™

    “…and you claim that a 1% share equates to a general consensus that Linux is a problem…where I think it’s more indicative of the majority of computer users being noobs to mildly tech savvy, which will undoubtedly affect your abilities on any Linux os.”

    Don’t you just love it when some self-important, self proclaimed “tech elitist” espouses Linux as a means of superiority. Only, to then belittle anyone else who does not use Linux as “noobs” and what not.

    LinuxHateIsMicrosoftLove™

    “Does the Mac OS X suck too? I’ve never used it, but it only has 5% market share as of about 6 months ago…based on your logic, it’s only slightly less of a plague than Linux, and can’t touch the healthy Vista OS at 22%.”

    It is also rather funny that operating systems are viewed as polarized extremes, complete with an ‘us or them’ mentality. You either use Linux or you are a Microsoft $hill sent to oppose all other operating systems.

  21. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    Now this is a rather funny question, can a Linux installation fully utilize the PS3’s hardware to process graphics?

  22. Kirk says:

    @Felipe

    “Don’t you just love it when some self-important, self proclaimed “tech elitist” espouses Linux as a means of superiority.”

    Actually, I love it when you’re in a forum trying to solve some issue with another operating system and one of these guys comes in and says, “Install Linux!”

  23. Anonymous says:

    It never ceases to amaze me how ignorant you are..
    I paid for a machine that does 3 things Bluray , Games , Linux..

    I want a refund..!

  24. bobcollum says:

    Psst Felipe, I’ve consistently used Windows for as long as i’ve had a PC. When I referred to noobs it was to highlight how it can be a turn-off when a OS takes a good deal of training to get the hang of, I was a noob once too, I just didn’t stop trying. Please don’t put words in my mouth. I don’t blame anyone for not going the distance with Linux.

    To the car reference…If windows is driving a car, than Linux is flying a plane…it is much more complicated, is this offending anyone? Could you imagine a noob flying a plane? Please refer to one of my first posts where I clearly state that Linux isn’t very user-friendly, which was never a basic premise of Linux. I’m sorry you’ve all seem to have had bad experiences with other Linux users, I assure you, minus my first comment which was a bit brash, I’m not trying to talk down to anyone, stop looking for extra meaning in my statements.

    Again, Linux isn’t a “plague”. If you don’t want to deal with it, you don’t have to.

    @tdurden 3828 and anyone else….why do you think they give it away? What kind of fools would try to sell something that isn’t free and easy right out of the box?

    I say it’s complicated and takes many hours to master, you take it as an insult to your intelligence. That’s all on you guys, not me. I can’t argue with this twisted logic.

  25. Kirk says:

    @Bobbie

    LOL! Your condescending comments are right on this blog entry for anyone to read. Maybe in the Linux community you can write something and then claim it doesn’t say what it says, but that doesn’t usually work outside of the cult.

    The funny thing is that you’ve been pretty much arguing with yourself the whole time. One side of you says that there is no problem with Linux then the other side acknowledges that Linux is not user friendly (i.e. a poor user experience). So, which is it?

    Or am I to understand your view is, “I can’t figure out how to start my car… but, that’s not a problem, it’s a great car.”

  26. bobcollum says:

    One time someone said to me “Led Zeppelin sucks.”

    I said “You mean you don’t like them, cause they certainly don’t suck.”

    I feel like I’m having this discussion again.

  27. bobcollum says:

    No I said Linux was like a plane, please re-read.

    I guess not being user-friendly is as much a problem as you let it be. It’s less of a problem for me I guess. Hence my take on it. We don’t agree on this obviously.

  28. Kirk says:

    Bobbie, planes are designed to be as user friendly as possible to reduce pilot error. This is important, because the last thing we want is to have hundreds of people die in a fiery tragedy.

    In fact, modern jets even have an autoland feature. That means the plane lands itself. Landing is the hardest part of flying – and now the pilot can choose to have the plane do it for him or her. Of course, before autolanding, you have to get to your destination… using autopilot.

    That doesn’t sound like user unfriendly Linux at all.

  29. bobcollum says:

    So you’d have no issue with hopping into the cockpit without any training or practice? I sure as hell wouldn’t want to.

  30. bobcollum says:

    I gotta tell ya, I don’t think you’re gonna sway my opinion on this on Kirk.

    Again, let’s not forget this all started when you called it a “plague”, which is still ridiculous in my mind.

  31. Squirrel says:

    Well ubuntu does a decent job of making linux user friendly (even friendlier in some capacities, since people who haven’t heard of viruses can use it without getting infected)

    But linux still can’t run all of the programs that Windows can (the reverse is also true). That’s why I run both (7 and fedora).

    @bobcollum
    *points finger* HE started it!

    but really, Windows is the plague, since most people end up with it without really being given a choice (that’s why it has infected such a large marked share).

    this just makes me think of this:

  32. bobcollum says:

    @Squirrel

    lol I’ve never seen that one.

    Thanks for the injection of humor. I needed that.

    Oh and your plague comment…agreed, even though I still use it everyday, right now in fact.

  33. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    “Psst Felipe, I’ve consistently used Windows for as long as i’ve had a PC. When I referred to noobs it was to highlight how it can be a turn-off when a OS takes a good deal of training to get the hang of, I was a noob once too, I just didn’t stop trying. Please don’t put words in my mouth. I don’t blame anyone for not going the distance with Linux.”

    You made a broad judgment pertaining to the skills of users using an operating system. In particular, the assumption that Linux users are more “tech savvy” by default. Or perhaps you forgot this statement:

    @ Posted at 5:21 pm on Apr 7th, 2010 by bobcollum
    “…where I think it’s more indicative of the majority of computer users being noobs to mildly tech savvy, which will undoubtedly affect your abilities on any Linux os.”

    Or even the application of the term “noobs” as describing those who do not use Linux.

    Posted at 9:08 am on Apr 7th, 2010 by bobcollum
    “How come noobs don’t gravitate more to that attractive and robust terminal?”

    Even more relevant, define and/or extrapolate upon the follow: “mildly tech savvy”, what constitutes as “training” pertaining to Linux and “noobs.”

  34. I paid for a machine that does 3 things Bluray , Games , Linux..

    That was pretty shortsighted of you. That Sony would even provide Linux support in the first place is suspect. Sony is well within their license agreements when they remove features, especially when they’re being used primarily for piracy.

    If you don’t like the fact that Sony has this control over their own ecosystem, maybe you should have had a little more foresight and bought a PC instead. It is possible to own both you know.

  35. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    Posted at 12:41 pm on Apr 8th, 2010 by Squirrel
    Ah a refreshing change to the comments, someone who recognizes that no operating system is perfect. You have my compliments.

    For the sake of being informative, Linux viruses do exist. Here is a link to an archive of a few old viruses. These should be safe due to the changes in Linux’s kernel.

    http://vx.netlux.org/vl.php?dir=Virus.Linux

  36. Nick says:

    @TM Repository:
    Who’s pirating games on the PS3 via linux?

    @ everyone else:
    Why is this turning into an OS fanboy fight? It doesn’t matter if you use it or not, or which OS you think is better.

    What matters is that it _was_ a feature which certainly influenced some peoples decision to buy the system, and now it’s being removed, in spite of the fact that on release of the non-linux-friendly PS3 slim, they explicitly said that PS3 fat systems would continue as is, and that Linux support would not be removed.

    Whether you think the feature is important or not, there are people who do use it, and this update ruins that for them. Most importantly, it’ll only be a minor inconvenience to the crackers, and will accomplish nothing in the long run, except to make a great piece of hardware less useful to a small percentage of their paying customers.

    As it is, I’m exclusively a Linux user on my PCs and have been for many years. One of my deciding factors on my choice between the PS3 and XBOX was that I could run Linux on it.

    While it’s far from being my main use of the PS3, it was that show of goodwill that influenced my purchasing decision.

    To fall back on the standard car analogy: You’re buying a car, and it comes down to 2 different brands. You like them about equally, but one of them comes with a CD player and the other has an 8 track. It’s not a huge factor really, but may as well grab the one with the CD, right?

    Then at your annual factory tune up, they remove your CD player, and replace it with an AM/FM radio.

    It’s not the main thing you bought the car for, but it’s still the reason you bought their car instead of the other.

  37. Kirk says:

    @Squirrel:

    But, Bobbie disagrees with you. Bobbie says, “Linux isn’t easy for sure, frustrating, yeah it can be to someone who is new to it, or even those that have moderate experience with it…but it wasn’t made with the goal of being very user-friendly…”

    @Bobbie:

    Your plane versus car analogy flat out doesn’t work. Linux is a general purpose operating system just like many other general purpose operating systems.

    So, either all general purpose operating systems are cars, or they are all planes, or they are all boats… or whatever you want. The difference is in how they perform and operate. Most products are designed to be user friendly. You have stated that Linux was not designed to be user friendly. That is why Linux only has a 1% market share and why companies that jump headlong into supporting it tend to regret their decision. One of the worst symptoms of the Linux plague is having to deal with people like you.

    I’m not trying to convince you of anything. I’m just having fun bantering with someone who is clueless.

  38. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    @ Posted at 12:41 pm on Apr 8th, 2010 by Squirrel

    “but really, Windows is the plague, since most people end up with it without really being given a choice (that’s why it has infected such a large marked share).”

    I disagree; people can by a computer from a third party without Windows preinstalled. A blatant example is provided by Dell. They sell computer preinstalled with Ubuntu and provide migration from Windows to Linux for enterprise workstations. http://linux.dell.com/ In addition, you can order a computer with no operating system preinstalled as a customized order from Dell.
    Or buy a MAC from Apple.

  39. Kirk says:

    @Nick:

    I’m in total agreement with you. The very first thing I said was that Sony was wrong to do this.

  40. bobcollum says:

    @Felipe

    Holy crapstains…now it’s an issue of semantics.

    Windows is great for ‘people that have very little experience with computers'(otherwise known as noobs…when did this become such an offensive term?), The OS gui and program guis are designed to do those little things that otherwise would be done manually in a terminal on Linux. A windows user can start at a very low level of experience/knowledge/practice/whatever, and eventually become mildly tech savvy, or even more in some cases. Many windows users I know that have reached a higher level of experience that ventured into Linux have found it to be just as Kirk found, aggravating. Do I think it’s an issue of intelligence? No way. Is it because Linux “sucks”? No again. It’s a matter of personal preference, what individual people want from their computer, and what they’re willing to do to get there. That was the reasoning behind my sarcastic “How come noobs don’t gravitate more to that attractive and robust terminal?” comment…I don’t expect people that have never really had to use a terminal or command lines to find it very enjoyable…it’s plain and boring looking.

    I like Linux, I think Windows 7 is great so far. I didn’t like the absurd plague comment(I think squirell succinctly hit that one), and I commented on it. How is calling it a plague not insulting to people that enjoy and use Linux, a free open-source OS that has been under the radar forever? Does Kirk know something that Linux experts don’t?

    What are you so bothered about? I never insulted anyone for using another OS, so I’m missing why you’ve become so offended by my comments and feel the need to try to pick my statements apart word for word. Go pick a fight with someone else…I can’t match your anger level.

  41. bobcollum says:

    Oh and Felipe, I think squirell meant it in the sense that if you had to pick one OS that is most closely resembling a plague, Windows would probably top the list.

  42. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    “Windows is great for ‘people that have very little experience with computers’(otherwise known as noobs…when did this become such an offensive term?),”

    I disagree, you continue to make the false dichotomy that Linux is for the “tech savy” and Windows is for “noobs.” Especially considering that you did not define “noob” or “tech savy.”

    “A windows user can start at a very low level of experience/knowledge/practice/whatever, and eventually become mildly tech savvy, or even more in some cases.”

    Once again define, “mildly tech savvy.” Define as well “higher level of experience”, oh the semantics due to subjective terminology and experience.

  43. bobcollum says:

    “I disagree, you continue to make the false dichotomy that Linux is for the “tech savy” and Windows is for “noobs.”

    “Newbie is a slang term for a newcomer or somebody inexperienced in any profession or activity. Contemporary use can particularly refer to a beginner or new user of computers, often concerning Internet activity, such as online gaming. It can have derogatory connotations, but is also often used for descriptive purposes only, without a value judgement.”

    Mild – 3. not extreme; moderate

    savvy – Slang
    vb -vies, -vying, -vied
    1. to understand or get the sense of (an idea, etc.)
    noun – comprehension

    I’ll assume you are aware of the meaning of the word technology.

    My use of “mildly tech savvy” can vary a lot, seeing as how there is a lot to know about computing in general. Let’s just say it falls somewhere in between newbie and someone that designs operating systems from the ground up.

    “oh the semantics due to subjective terminology and experience.”

    Like saying “Then we’ll have further proof that Linux is a plague upon all who support it!”

    Yay we’ve come full-circle.

  44. bobcollum says:

    Ok, I’m taking the Felipe approach to this now.

    Kirk, define “plague”.

  45. Kirk says:

    @Bobbie:

    “How is calling it a plague not insulting to people that enjoy and use Linux, a free open-source OS that has been under the radar forever?”

    I can certainly understand that Linux fans would be insulted by my statement, but sometimes that sort of thing is unavoidable when stating facts that are uncomfortable for certain interest groups.

    “Does Kirk know something that Linux experts don’t?”

    Most Linux experts agree with me in the context of Linux in the consumer market. Unless you have a model of direct revenue from supporting Linux, it is an extremely unprofitable endeavor.

    In Sony’s case, it was just a bullet point that didn’t garner them enough increase in sales to justify having to burn up resources answering angry customers asking why this or that didn’t work right in Linux under the PS3. “That’s a Linux issue”, says Sony. “But, you said you supported Linux!”, says angry customer.

    That is the plague of Linux.

  46. bobcollum says:

    “I can certainly understand that Linux fans would be insulted by my statement, but sometimes that sort of thing is unavoidable when stating facts that are uncomfortable for certain interest groups.”

    Well any facts should have some easily discernible proof to back it up, unless it’s just an opinion.

    “Most Linux experts agree with me in the context of Linux in the consumer market. Unless you have a model of direct revenue from supporting Linux, it is an extremely unprofitable endeavor.”

    Agreed, it doesn’t have much potential for profit. But seeing as how it wasn’t created or intended to be a large money-making machine for the non-commercial user, how is that relevant? What does that have to do with the plague reference?

    “In Sony’s case, it was just a bullet point that didn’t garner them enough increase in sales to justify having to burn up resources answering angry customers asking why this or that didn’t work right in Linux under the PS3. “That’s a Linux issue”, says Sony. “But, you said you supported Linux!”, says angry customer.

    That is the plague of Linux.”

    You don’t have to use it? Should I say it again? Nobody has a gun to your head.

    Secondly, Sony isn’t doing this because they are sick of answering questions about Linux on the PS3, I can’t imagine that 1% of the OS market share gets any larger when speaking of it’s use on the PS3…it’s because of the hacking of the system.

  47. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    @Posted at 2:21 pm on Apr 8th, 2010 by bobcollum
    “Like saying “Then we’ll have further proof that Linux is a plague upon all who support it!”
    Yay we’ve come full-circle.”

    Yet another example of an ‘us or them’ mentality, now you assume I am supporting Kirk.

    @Posted at 2:26 pm on Apr 8th, 2010 by bobcollum

    Lol, the Felipe approach? I am not the one who is using variable terminology here. To reiterate:

    “My use of “mildly tech savvy” can vary a lot, seeing as how there is a lot to know about computing in general. Let’s just say it falls somewhere in between newbie and someone that designs operating systems from the ground up.”

    This still does not change the fact that you are committing a false dichotomy, instead of acknowledging that a operating system can have users who use it for simple or/and advanced purposes you simply reiterate that Linux is for the “tech savy” and Windows is for “noobs.” Your definition of “noob” and previous statements are evidence of this.

    I still want the definition for “higher level of experience”, is that variable as well?

  48. bobcollum says:

    Does it sound variable? For such a smart-ass you sure ask a lot of questions.

    “Yet another example of an ‘us or them’ mentality, now you assume I am supporting Kirk.”

    Accuse me of what you will, I think you’re typecasting me with what you consider to be an elitist cabal of linux users, and I’m telling you you’re barking up the wrong tree. But go ahead and continue to work at the semantics angle. Do I think you’re supporting Kirk? Really I think you’re some guy that is helping to distract from what started all of this. I’m sure you’ll continue to tell me that my opinion is wrong and yours is right.

    “instead of acknowledging that a operating system can have users who use it for simple or/and advanced purposes you simply reiterate that Linux is for the “tech savy” and Windows is for “noobs.”

    Are you insane? Windows in my opinion is the easiest OS to use in order to get acclimated to computers…this is a credit to Microsoft, it’s why they are where they are. Having done both, that is how i feel. Could someone start from scratch with Linux? Uh, I don’t see why not, but as I thought we had established, Windows is more user-friendly, which I thought equated to ease of use, which I thought would be easier to someone just starting out, which at some point is everybody. I thought Linux was more of a pain in the ass to do things that were otherwise fairly simple in windows, maybe because I was accustomed to the gui aspect of Windows…but I guess my opinion and personal experience doesn’t count when I’m talking to you.

  49. Kirk says:

    Kirk says, “Most Linux experts agree with me in the context of Linux in the consumer market. Unless you have a model of direct revenue from supporting Linux, it is an extremely unprofitable endeavor.”

    Bobbie says, “Agreed, it doesn’t have much potential for profit. But seeing as how it wasn’t created or intended to be a large money-making machine for the non-commercial user, how is that relevant? What does that have to do with the plague reference?”

    Sony is not in business just because it’s fun Bobbie. They are trying to make money. So, I’d say the money making, or rather the money draining, aspect of supporting Linux is very relevant. As I said in my very first comment, it is a plague upon all who support it.

    Sony is not alone. Asus is another one that comes to mind. They got burned when they initially shipped all their netbooks with Linux. Go to Best Buy now and see how many Linux netbooks you find. You’ll probably have to special order one.

    Is the plague reference troubling you because I didn’t spell out its common vectors? The common vectors are doey eyed ideologues and feckless executives that think they are going to get something for nothing.

    Sony is the perfect example. “We can increase sales by supporting this thing called Linux without having to spend any resources on it, because they have a community that already supports them!”, says ideologue to greedy and clueless executive.

    Sony stopped supporting Linux on the slim before they took it away from everyone else. That’s a clear indication that they wanted out long before they came up with the “security concern” excuse. The “security concern” is just a way to try and make users feel like Sony was looking out for them rather than just not wanting to keep dedicating resources to a small band of yackers.

    Sony cutting their losses is the right business move, but what they did is wrong. As soon as they said they supported installing other operating systems (i.e. Linux) they boxed themselves into a corner with a no-win situation. They shouldn’t have promised something they couldn’t deliver on. I don’t think it was a ruse, I think they simply didn’t know what they were getting themselves into.

  50. Felipe J. Stroud says:

    “Does it sound variable? For such a smart-ass you sure ask a lot of questions.”
    I did not create the terminology, you did. Hence, I require a definition due to the fact that I cannot read minds.
    “Accuse me of what you will, I think you’re typecasting me with what you consider to be an elitist cabal of linux users, and I’m telling you you’re barking up the wrong tree.”
    Your previous statements verify that you are committing a false dichotomy, specifically:
    “…where I think it’s more indicative of the majority of computer users being noobs to mildly tech savvy, which will undoubtedly affect your abilities on any Linux os.”
    Yes, you are acting as an elitist Linux user by creating a variable scale of “tech savyness” to compare and belittle Windows users. The only solid point on that scale is the qualification for being a “noob.”

    “Really I think you’re some guy that is helping to distract from what started all of this.”
    Oh boy here comes the conspiracy theories. Distract from what? That Sony made a decision to change their firmware and Linux zealots are throwing a hissy fit?

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